tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post9674264255142614..comments2023-11-03T02:45:14.110-05:00Comments on I Have Touched the Sky: The Daily Grind: Intrinsic vs. Extrinsic Motivation In MMOsrowanblazehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06820814610269599162noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-19189714127715294452012-10-26T07:28:25.623-05:002012-10-26T07:28:25.623-05:00This!This!Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01049258767148958369noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-5753396084319218812012-10-25T16:20:30.185-05:002012-10-25T16:20:30.185-05:00I had to look those two up. Crazy stuff.I had to look those two up. Crazy stuff.rowanblazehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06820814610269599162noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-72756916874066856822012-10-25T15:58:43.445-05:002012-10-25T15:58:43.445-05:00Exactly, no barrier to entry. Cheng mentions in th...Exactly, no barrier to entry. Cheng mentions in the article that the release version will be available on Steam.rowanblazehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06820814610269599162noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-5476083586284325702012-10-25T15:41:51.663-05:002012-10-25T15:41:51.663-05:00I think you are right; I'm giving too much cre...I think you are right; I'm giving too much credit to willpower as well, particularly in a research setting. Too soon we forget the lessons of Zimbardo and Milgrim eh? (-:Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-12752877736216606832012-10-25T15:38:46.442-05:002012-10-25T15:38:46.442-05:00Sure if Xbox were one of three major options in co...Sure if Xbox were one of three major options in consoles, all of which were free. :-pAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-17797311609457946702012-10-25T12:53:29.902-05:002012-10-25T12:53:29.902-05:00Eh, that's like saying HALO is an extrinsic mo...Eh, that's like saying HALO is an extrinsic motivation to get an XBox.rowanblazehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06820814610269599162noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-44809518935043885002012-10-25T12:51:23.703-05:002012-10-25T12:51:23.703-05:00I look forward to reading your idea.
I do think y...I look forward to reading your idea.<br /><br />I do think you give too much credit to force of will, here. I'm a pretty willful person, and I find myself falling into the trap of working toward a reward rather than enjoying a game for the gameplay/story. The poor children in that study didn't have the wherewithal to resist the pull of the reward. The article even specifically mentioned that the quality of the children's drawings went down, even as their output increased. Hard to say how this is reflected in an adult workplace environment, after all most people work for the reward of money, not the pleasure of work. And we've already discussed the pitfalls of turning one's hobby into a job.<br /><br />Currencies as reward are interesting, I think I may have another blog post on the way.rowanblazehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06820814610269599162noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-61849482764779592262012-10-25T12:43:05.973-05:002012-10-25T12:43:05.973-05:00Ah, forgot to mention. I love that the Penny Arca...Ah, forgot to mention. I love that the Penny Arcade article on extrinsic/intrinsic motivation is written by a developer whose game is essentially a forced extrinsic motivation for using the Chrome browser. There's an awesome level of fail somewhere in all that. (-:Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-31054426882338816852012-10-25T12:37:25.017-05:002012-10-25T12:37:25.017-05:00In terms of the drawing study, I think that become...In terms of the drawing study, I think that becomes and internal problem then right? The reward can hang out there, but you can still work solely for your love at your discretion. That may not be entirely true give peer pressure and authority figures, but its not an automatic. In any case, the way around that is to make the reward dynamic rather than static - in MMO terms, offer a currency rather than an item, and then use the currency to offer a store full of items. I truly believe this is one of the reasons currency conversion in F2P games like GW2 and STO are good and not bad, despite what developers say.<br /><br />In terms of level-less gaming, I really want that day to come quickly. I have an idea for how to do it, but I'll save that for a blog post for me. (-:Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-62072659333644208582012-10-25T12:32:17.920-05:002012-10-25T12:32:17.920-05:00This reminds me of an old saying: "If you wa...This reminds me of an old saying: "If you want to live the dream, you have to give up the fantasy."<br /><br />My friend discovered this when he became a dive shop owner. He did it because he thought it would allow him to do what he loved all the time. But in reality it meant less time for him to do what he loved. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-53130722848334409222012-10-25T10:50:45.400-05:002012-10-25T10:50:45.400-05:00Ah yes, I remember reading that now. It does tie i...Ah yes, I remember reading that now. It does tie indirectly into this idea of reward-based gaming vs. fun-based gaming. Obviously, it's a spectrum. From my first minutes playing WoW to last night's adventures in GW2, there is an element of "reward" XP, leveling). But it's mostly pure fun, at least at first. I've long gotten over continuing to play something after the thrill is gone, again, thanks to lessons learned in WoW.rowanblazehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06820814610269599162noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-26594690933125127252012-10-25T09:55:04.392-05:002012-10-25T09:55:04.392-05:00Bah, forgot the link... maybe I'm naturally sl...Bah, forgot the link... maybe I'm naturally slightly allergic to shameless self-promotion. ;) http://tishtoshtesh.wordpress.com/2012/05/09/nbi-for-love-or-money/Teshhttp://tishtoshtesh.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-85998050462320032162012-10-25T09:54:28.439-05:002012-10-25T09:54:28.439-05:00I went over that a bit a while back. I wish that ...I went over that a bit a while back. I wish that the "follow your passions into a career" pop psych would die already. I think it's done immeasurable harm.Teshhttp://tishtoshtesh.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-79570821236305633762012-10-25T09:23:06.074-05:002012-10-25T09:23:06.074-05:00@HZero: One solution I forgot to mention, I just h...@HZero: One solution I forgot to mention, I just haven't really seen it in any game I've played, is no levels at all. TSW pays lip service to it, bu the truth is you can't take a brand new character straight into Transylvania, or even Savage Coast. You need skills (and abilities), so it's leveling by another name. There are several games that encourage some form of mentoring. I vaguely recall one of the superhero MMOs having "sidekicking," but I don't know if lowbies could join higher level heroes in their areas.<br /><br />@Tesh: I think that is the conclusion of the research that's been done. Plus it bears out in anecdotes about people "following their passions" and discovering that hobby isn't so great when you have to make a living from it.rowanblazehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06820814610269599162noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-22742672837371779002012-10-25T09:07:29.717-05:002012-10-25T09:07:29.717-05:00Perhaps because the reward turns the task into a j...Perhaps because the reward turns the task into a job, effectively. Maybe it's a fun job, maybe it's not, but it's no longer about doing the task itself, it's about the reward.Teshhttp://tishtoshtesh.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-45014876251322541462012-10-24T19:56:07.422-05:002012-10-24T19:56:07.422-05:00The article from Penny Arcade included a link to a...The article from Penny Arcade included a link to a study about how rewards for drawing affected children who already enjoyed drawing. I don't know how extensive it was. I do know that there have been times when working toward a reward has diminished my enjoyment of an otherwise fun activity. The free month of SWTOR for players who achieved a certain Legacy level comes to mind. rowanblazehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06820814610269599162noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4765136501328523372.post-72414725739953659482012-10-24T16:53:11.758-05:002012-10-24T16:53:11.758-05:00I think fears around gamification are misplaced. ...I think fears around gamification are misplaced. If the child/participant already has an intrinsic interest or desire around the task, the gamification is icing on the cake. If not, it provides a reason for it. It seems like the hand-wringing is around the assumption that those without interest or desire somehow spontaneously develop it when no extrinsically rewarded through gamification. Such a thing is rare at best.<br /><br />In terms of levels - you note GW2's downleveling, which is to be commended. But my question is - why is there not upleveling as well? Why is it that if I want to play with my level 80 friends, I must either be a PvP player, or they must return to content they have already done?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com